Comments on: Rome is Rome is Rome…on Merit, Grace and Salvation

By: Josh S

Josh S — Fri, 27 Apr 2007 18:25:07 +0000

Mark in Spokane, I would like to remind you of a famous saying by St Cyprian: “Tradition without truth is merely ancient error.”

By: Christine

Christine — Tue, 24 Apr 2007 14:52:52 +0000

The Joint Declaration on Justification can never attain harmony with orthodox Lutheran theology. My ten year stint in the Catholic Church was a real eye opener in that regard.
As long as the Mass is viewed as a re-presentation of the sacrifice of Calvary for the sins of the living and the dead the solas of Lutheran soteriology will never make sense to Rome.
The completed work of Calvary, the fruits of which are received in Holy Communion for the Lutheran, leaves no room for meritorious works.
Indulgences remain, as does the concept of purgatory and “making satisfaction for one’s sins” by penance (one of Jerome’s greatest blunders in mistranslating “repentance.”)
Very few lay Catholics are capable of internalizing the complex teachings of Rome concerning the necessity of good works “in union with Christ.” At the popular level it too often translates to “the most important thing is to be a good person.”

By: Mark in Spokane

Mark in Spokane — Mon, 23 Apr 2007 19:44:23 +0000

As a Catholic who is very sympathetic to confessional Lutheran theology, I would note in defense of the Compendium’s formulation of the question of merit that this strain in Christian teaching isn’t simply some kind of Tridentine invention, but stretches well back to the patristic era (St. Augustine’s Treatise on Faith & Works comes to mind).

By: Bryce Wandrey

Bryce Wandrey — Mon, 23 Apr 2007 14:48:28 +0000

It may simply be helpful, and fair, to be sure to couch the Roman Catholic treatment of merit in what they say about Justification and Grace (especially, since these teachings on Merit are consequent to what they teach on Justification and Grace). [McCain: Pastor Wandrey, as I'm sure you would agree, Rome's statements on justification assert some true things. But what Rome gives with the one hand, it takes away with the other when it comes to explaining merit and precisely how we receive justifying grace and what that grace is. Then, like I said, it is clear that it is simply the "same old, same old" and we are right back to the debates of the 16th century. What is often not understood is that the chief argument we have with Rome is not about a definition of "grace" or even necessarily the specific definition of "justification" but in how and by what means these are given to man, and what man's role is in receiving them from God. The argument has never been over "grace" or "faith" or but on the "alone" that Lutheranism, on the basis of the Bible, insists must come with those words. Hence, it is justification by grace ALONE, through faith ALONE, on account of Christ ALONE, apart from any merit or worthiness, of ANY KIND, in human beings.]

By: jmelms

jmelms — Sat, 21 Apr 2007 21:37:30 +0000

The latest release form the Vatican was on the retraction of Limbo — but the theology of that is also warped. They again try to say for God what God has not said in His Word.
See: http://www.rockymounttelegram.com/news/content/shared-gen/ap/Europe/Vatican_Limbo.html

By: Chi Chi

Chi Chi — Fri, 20 Apr 2007 18:45:55 +0000

Same old, salvation by grace through faith and works, which is still not the same as, salvation by grace through faith that works, the latter of which is, of course, biblical.